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  #1  
Old 11-20-2007, 09:45 PM
Thangor Thangor is offline
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Default Covert

PureDamnEvil wants to know how everyone feels about covert.
He is wanting to remove it but will keep it if enough people want him to so far it is not looking good for covert.

I personal am for getting rid of it. I never use it and am sick of having to keep tons of enforcers to prevent it.

COvert might come back at a later time as something else.
as for the covert races they will either be modified or removed.

Also please only respond to this post if you are actively playing because honestly if your not playing your vote shouldn't count.
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  #2  
Old 11-20-2007, 10:31 PM
Lacrosse_Freak Lacrosse_Freak is offline
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Default Re: Covert

I vote covert stays.

This game has three real threats, military attack, magic, and covert. Take away one, and races lose strengths, others lose the only way to check their power. Do I find it annoying that I need to dump resources and effort into defending against it? Your damn skippy, but that doesn't mean I don't like a challenge.

Imagining the game without covert leaves me with an image of something that isn't nearly as fun. You can't kill off folks researchers and support troops to wreck their ability to spell you, it takes high level magic to damage their research and so on. I know I must not know/understand the entire problem, but I don't think scraping a third of the game to fix some problems is the way to go.

That's my vote, and my two cents. Take away covert and this game loses an entire dimension.
  #3  
Old 11-20-2007, 11:21 PM
Dopey Dopey is offline
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Default Re: Covert

keep it, totally agree with lacrosse on this one
  #4  
Old 11-20-2007, 11:42 PM
PureDamnEvil PureDamnEvil is offline
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Default Re: Covert

So its good for a dwarf to loose all their wms in one turn?
Ask lsd, he didnt find it very fun and Im sick of trying to balance it. So I started asking for anyone that liked it or wanted it. Billion was the first person I found that even wanted to keep it at all. These last two votes make a total of 3 people that want it kept in the game.

The plan if I do remove it is it would come back later when I can completely rewrite it so it allows for stealing of gold, food and weapons and armor. Plus you would get auto steals from trades close to the covert races score. Also there would be things a covert race could do to lower morale of a target plus generally harass. But no stealing "tech" like it is now. Sure you can steal research to get smarter in econ, ent etc but the victum wouldnt lose the tech like now.

Ive got way to many emails and site messages from people wanting something done about it. Lsd was saying he was quitting if something wasnt done.

I havent counted all the votes for removing up till now since I couldnt find anyone till now that wanted it but its somewhere around 30 or more against, 3 for keeping it.
  #5  
Old 11-21-2007, 01:34 AM
lsd lsd is offline
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Default Re: Covert

Although path kinda said how i feel already i just wanted to make sure covert is gone, so here is my vote

NO MORE COVERT PLEASE!!!!!!!
  #6  
Old 11-21-2007, 02:47 AM
OrbofThralni OrbofThralni is offline
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Default Re: Covert

You already know that I want it removed... so I have no reason to "vote" but I do, however, really like the ideas you just expressed about the new covert system you're creating... Thumbs up man.

And it makes sense to get smarter from a kingdom without actually stealing their tech... (it's really a pain to have to try to study all that mess back [which is why I think the "tech bug" up in the higher scores should be removed]).

Getting rid of the current covert system would only work to better the game... really is boring to log on and find that all your tech is gone because you just happened to lose all your enforcers because they were cut up in their sleep. ;/
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  #7  
Old 11-21-2007, 11:37 AM
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Flame Flame is offline
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Default Re: Covert

Covert should stay. I happen to love it, I think it sucks right now that you can't spy which is something a ninja should be able to do and please don't say they can do it path because unless you have hella amounts of covert troops with hella exp it's really not possible. Maybe the solution can be to make more gt the needed thing for covert and less enf to help guard it to reduce the amount needed to guard your tech. I think covert steals 5% right now which isn't the end of the world for alot of the races right now but blows for some of the war races so maybe reduce it to 3%. Also, each thief steals 1 wms each loot so if you have 100k, well, you get the idea, that can be changed to a set amount for how many by score, not by how many thieves are used. It's fixable and it saddens me that ya'll are so gung ho to let go a part of the game that is so much fun and just because it's not your "thing" you want to ditch it. How'ld you feel if it was war that was up for this? Next it'll be magic. Whatcha gonna do when someone comes up and starts laying down those undispellable spells or you have spells on you every day on all your accounts every day? Are we going to have another thread like this trying to vote magic out too just because magic's not your "thing" and it's ruining your fun? You say lsd wants to quit because of covert, well what about the vets that won't play because of how bad covert is now? Jarl...Drow...Those names ring any bells to ya'll?

When I say covert should stay, I mean I think covert should not be permanently removed. I think path's original idea of removing it and rewriting it from scratch is the best option. I don't want my post misunderstood.

As a side note, part of the problem here is also alot of you guys rush to the top with ranger farming, jumping score(hiring researchers), getting landfat and you don't have a good defense or enough enf and assume no one's doing covert or no one's going to hit you and when you get the sh!t kicked out of you, you want to pass the blame. Hire the enf, build your def before logging off or know that you're taking a chance, don't just assume you're safe.

I don't know exactly what high lvl tech bug you're talking about ES but if it's the one that happens over 50 mil for not logging in for 3 days, that has nothing to do with covert and has no business even being in this thread.
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  #8  
Old 11-21-2007, 01:45 PM
Jarlaxle Jarlaxle is offline
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Default Re: Covert

I am playing right now, but certainly not 100%. The only reason I play is because I have played for so long; habit? addiction? I havn't played in what seems like years because covert is too weak... not because it is too strong.

Rock, paper, scissors isn?t exactly the most stimulating game ever invented, but it damn sure beats flipping a coin. If you take covert out of the game, that is exactly what you will turn it into.

Suggestions for covert:

Stealing tech should give to the stealer research as usual, but instead of taking tech from the defender, make it should be like a duration special attack. The gold income and morale for that kingdom will be greatly depleted for X number of turns per steal.

One thief stealing a war machine by himself does seem a bit crazy. Engineers should get exp just like other troops. Several of them should be required per war machine (for the same reason one thief stealing a war machine is illogical). Effectiveness of war machines will depend on war machine rating AND engineer exp. Higher exp on engineers would make them tougher so that less are killed per assassination. More thieves than just one should be required to run off with a war machine. It should take at least 10 or more. And, it should take at least three engineers to run a war machine.

Since stealing troop exp was taken out, that was the last straw for covert; at least for me. Having to run tons of researchers AND covert just doesn?t cut the mustard. Each military action should give exp to military troops. Winning or losing should not make a difference; losing usually teaches you more anyway.

Any offensive action taken (military, covert, or spell cast on any kingdom other than your own) should remove ALL abuse slots; military and covert. Heck, it should remove abuse slots from your multies too ` )

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  #9  
Old 11-22-2007, 05:47 PM
OrbofThralni OrbofThralni is offline
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Default Re: Covert

Quote:
Any offensive action taken (military, covert, or spell cast on any kingdom other than your own) should remove ALL abuse slots; military and covert. Heck, it should remove abuse slots from your multies too ` )
So with the current Covert system, if you retal on ONE offensive war attack (and let's say you've been looted to abuse already), since you've got all your abuse slots open... you're open to be looted ANOTHER 10 or 12 times without even getting the chance to study that stuff back... and since 5% is stolen, that's already over half of the tech you initially had gone to covert attacks... Nobody wants to spend time having to study that mess all over again... and that's not balanced whatsoever.

Let's say you get attack to abuse... using the current war system (since your statement encompasses ALL offensive aspects of the game, I will be including this...) let's say you got abused by a HG ... which attacks 30 times ... and let's say he took land each time... That's already left you with pretty much NO land (if you even have any left) secondly, if you attack, loot, or spell that person 1 time then all the abuse slots are gone and they're open to attack you another 30 times.

If you MUST keep covert the way it is, then the amount of tech taken away should be lowered considerably. It's 5% now, and that's already to much for at least 30 people... 2% sounds more reasonable...
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  #10  
Old 11-22-2007, 08:19 PM
lsd lsd is offline
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Default Re: Covert

And i dont know who you are talking about thats ranger farming to jump score i have not ranger farmed once this reset except when i had my WE for the first week...the rest of my chars i have fought to get the land they had. and i know how to build a good defense but the way it is now you either can protect your tech, or your land you have to choose....i had over 500k enf on one guy and still got looted and was to weak to protect my land cause those enforcers bumped my score too much, so before you start saying what the problem is why dont you know the problem first.
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